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Thread: Are Warlocks supposed to be able to wear heavy armor?

  • 10-09-2015, 11:58 AM#1

    archlyte is offline
    Community Member archlyte's Avatar

    Default Are Warlocks supposed to be able to wear heavy armor?

    Warlocks can wear heavy armor and not suffer effective penalties to any of their inherent abilities. With very little tweaking a Warlock can be super effective without taking the proficiencies for heavy armor or the enhancements that reduce spell failure. Is this how the class was intended to work? If so why have sorceror or wizard when you can blast away as warlock with high PRR? Also why do other classes have to have the feat for the armor when this class doesn't?


  • 10-09-2015, 12:08 PM#2


  • 10-09-2015, 12:10 PM#3


  • 10-09-2015, 12:11 PM#4


  • 10-09-2015, 12:12 PM#5


  • 10-09-2015, 12:13 PM#6


  • 10-09-2015, 01:15 PM#7

    archlyte is offline
    Community Member archlyte's Avatar

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    Ok so looks like it is working as intended. That was mainly what I wondered. Feels broken but whatever.


  • 10-09-2015, 01:21 PM#8


  • 10-09-2015, 01:36 PM#9

    archlyte is offline
    Community Member archlyte's Avatar

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    QuoteOriginally Posted by Steve_HoweView Post

    I think it bears repeating that for Warlocks, the Arcane Spell Failure (ASF) chance DOES apply to the Warlock's spells like Shield and Sleep. It does NOT affect any form of a Warlock's Eldritch Blast (ranged or aura).

    Yeah but the eldritch blast is sufficient, the occasional failure to cast the spells is a minor inconvenience compared with the ability to don Heavy Armor with no prof and blast things to no end. The class should have had penalties to EB dmg for wearing non-proficient armor.

  • 10-09-2015, 01:48 PM#10


  • 10-09-2015, 02:34 PM#11

    Chi_Ryu is offline
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    QuoteOriginally Posted by DDOTalk71View Post

    So, if you are going to be a warlock or bard in heavy armor, it is a good idea to splash a class that gets Heavy Armor Proficency (Pally/Fighter/Cleric) or take the feat. Especially if you will be meleeing. But the PRR bonus alone makes the feat worthwhile.

    #1: You can't just take the feat, unless you are Warforged or Bladeforged; sadly, you'd need to take Light Armour Proficiency, then Medium Armour Proficiency, and then finally Heavy Armour Proficiency.

    #2: If splashing 1 Paladin/Fighter/Cleric, then you lose the capstone, which for Enlightened Spirit gives you full BAB, instead of 3/4 BAB (and an extra +20% HP, +10 Melee Power, +20 Light, +2 Con & Cha, etc.). That's quite a sacrifice for a gain of 14 PRR*, and 10 MRR.

    Also, it has been noted in the Known Issues that ASF shold affect Eldritch Blasts**, and that this is a bug - none of the enhancements decrease the ASF on shields or Heavy Armour. Something to consider.

    As for wearing Heavy Armour without proficiency, that is only better than wearing medium armour up until level 12, for a pure Warlock, and has the cost of a much lower max dex bonus (reducing both Dex AC and Dodge).

    * A 19/1 War/Pal or equivalent has a BAB of 15. That makes 51PRR and 30MRR, versus 37PRR and 20MRR with medium armour and the proficiency enhancement.
    ** "Arcane Spell Failure incorrectly fails to apply to basic attack forms of Eldritch Blast."

  • 10-09-2015, 02:37 PM#12


  • 10-09-2015, 02:37 PM#13


  • 10-09-2015, 02:52 PM#14

    Default Here we go, yet again

    QuoteOriginally Posted by unbongwahView Post

    From the Known Issues list: "Arcane Spell Failure incorrectly fails to apply to basic attack forms of Eldritch Blast." This implies that ASF is supposed to affect EB, which makes sense since there's clearly a somatic component. Doesn't indicate if SLAs, Spirit Burst, etc. are also supposed to be affected by ASF, though.

    This is the best statement; a reminder that ASF should affect Warlocks.

    Not sure why the Devs won't fix this in a hotfix.

    The Shadow Sage of Nusemne


    (LYCEUM OF SHADOW): "ONLY FOOLS CALL THE SHADOW EVIL"


  • 10-09-2015, 02:54 PM#15

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    QuoteOriginally Posted by archlyteView Post

    Warlocks can wear heavy armor and not suffer effective penalties to any of their inherent abilities. With very little tweaking a Warlock can be super effective without taking the proficiencies for heavy armor or the enhancements that reduce spell failure. Is this how the class was intended to work? If so why have sorceror or wizard when you can blast away as warlock with high PRR? Also why do other classes have to have the feat for the armor when this class doesn't?

    It was reported on the known issues when Warlock first came out.


    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...l-Known-Issues
    Classes:
    •Warlock:
    •Arcane Spell Failure incorrectly fails to apply to basic attack forms of Eldritch Blast.

    Argo: Degenerate Matter - 200
    Jotmon (HC 34/42 , RC 39/39 , IC 12/21 , EC 48/48 , RP 104/158)
    Jotlock (HC 38/42 , RC 0/39 , IC 15/21 , EC 36/48 , RP 36/158)
    Whatthetruck (HC 38/42 , RC 39/39 , IC 15/21 , EC 48/48 , RP 108/158)


  • 10-09-2015, 03:14 PM#16


  • 10-09-2015, 03:27 PM#17

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    QuoteOriginally Posted by TlorrdView Post

    Just look at the devs thinking with AA. They're clearly considering those changes heavily with monkchers in mind even though from a base standpoint AA is a ranger or elf feature, but since they're (or at least were) so many monkchers, the devs are making enhancement decisions based on this multiclass build.

    So it will be the same with this issue. Warlock heavy armor builds are the staple of many different warlocks/multiclass warlock builds. They won't change it any time soon.

    I can't argue against your statement, but isn't this part of the power creep problem? As a Warlock, I am saddened that monkchers are dictating game culture. This game needs boundaries.

    The Shadow Sage of Nusemne


    (LYCEUM OF SHADOW): "ONLY FOOLS CALL THE SHADOW EVIL"


  • 10-09-2015, 04:16 PM#18


  • 10-09-2015, 04:20 PM#19

    draven1 is offline
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    QuoteOriginally Posted by redoubtView Post

    Give -50% run speed for non-proficient... lol...

    Good idea!

    “Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness.
    Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness.
    Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate.”
    - Sun Tzu, The Art of War


  • 10-09-2015, 04:38 PM#20


  • Sours: https://www.ddo.com/forums/

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    The warlock is a character class in Dungeons & Dragons. Warlocks possess innate dark magic acquired through pacts with powerful beings.

    Abilities

    Note: The exact abilities of character classes vary by rules edition.

    Power source

    The warlock draws on a pact made with a powerful extraplanar being—perhaps an archdevil, an elder evil, or some faerie lord—to unleash deadly magical attacks and terrible curses.

    Each warlock's relationship with their patron is unique. Some pledge their eternal and unwavering devotion as a cleric or paladin to their deity; some see themselves as more of an apprentice to their dark master; others stumble into a pact with an enigmatic being by accident, and only barely comprehend that the nature of their new patron or the connection they now share.[1]

    In some cases, a warlock did not voluntarily enter into a pact, but inherited the curse from an ancestor. Others did not choose to be a conduit for their otherworldly patron, but were chosen as their emissary.[2] Some warlocks communicate with their patron through their familiar; some by meetings with the being's minions, others only by reading omens in nature or interpreting prophetic visions or dreams.[1]

    Unlike a cleric, who relies on his deity's favor to continue receiving his spells, a warlock does not require obedience to retain the gifts given them by their patron. Warlocks have been known to defect from their patron and turn the power taken from their dark lord against them.[2]

    Eldritch blast

    Most warlocks are known for an ability known as eldritch blast, a dangerous beam of crackling energy. It is one of the first abilities acquired by a warlock. Unlike a wizard's spells, which are typically limited in their daily use, a warlock's capacity to employ their eldritch blast is seemingly unlimited.[1]

    Invocations

    Warlocks master a unique form of dark magic known as invocations. These ancient and forgotten secrets change the warlock's being, empowering them with innate and superhuman abilities.

    Eldritch invocations are as numerous and unique as the individual warlocks who use them. They include the ability to detect magic by sight and see through darkness, to compel a person with their voice alone or speak the language of wild animals, to read all writing even in ancient and forgotten languages, and to curse a creature by touch.[1]

    Spells

    A warlock who studies in arcane lore may learn arcane spells, although not to the same extent as the wizard who dedicates themself singly to that art.[1]

    Other

    A warlock may receive other rewards from their patron. They may possess a familiar, even an unusual creature such as an imp or pseudodragon. They may learn to conjure a weapon, or acquire a grimoire known as a Book of Shadows in which to hold their arcane lore. Such pact boons reflect the warlock's relationship with their patron.[1]

    The warlock's studies of arcane lore may allow them to become talented at the use and creation of magic items. They may gain resilience to injury.[2]

    Appearance and personality

    Many warlocks are evil, and even those who are not are widely mistrusted and misunderstood. Evil warlocks in the service of archdevils and demon princes lead cults to worship those dark beings, who do not normally attract clerics as gods do.[2]

    Still, even the most righteous of warlocks have an overwhelming desire for power, and warlocks are ardent seekers of forgotten knowledge. Some first sought out their pact as a shortcut to attaining forbidden knowledge, and may resent the fealty demanded by their patron.

    A once-evil warlock turned to the side of good is fearless in the face of the evil they know all too well. Good or evil, a warlock is often chaotic in alignment, rejected by the society they abandoned in their search for forbidden lore.[2]

    Cursed tieflings and ambitious humans are the most likely to become warlocks, as are half-orcs, often rejected in both human and orc society. Warlocks of other races are known, but rare.[2]

    Warlocks typically wear light armor, such as leather, and do not train with martial weapons or shields as a fighter would, dedicating themselves instead to the study of lore and acquisition of wealth and power.

    Notable warlocks

    For a list of all warlocks, see Category:Warlocks.

    Publication history

    Earlier editions

    Prior to the publication of D&D 3.5 sourcebook Complete Arcane in November 2004, "warlock" was commonly used as a synonym for wizard rather than representing a distinct character class.

    "Warlock" was first used in this way in the Original D&D Men & Magic (1974), p.17, as a level title for an 8th-level magic-user. Specific NPCs referred to as a "warlock" include wizard/thiefSaeryk the Warlock (Warlock of the Stonecrowns (1995)) and Polhemus the Warlock (College of Wizardry (1998))

    The D&D 3.5 Monster Manual, p.127, described that githyanki wizards are called warlocks.

    AD&D 2nd edition

    The warlock as understood today first appeared as a wizard variant in the AD&D Player's Option: Spells & Magic (1996), p.83-85, intended for campaign settings where magic is dangerous and can only be attained by communing with evil extraplanar entities. They use a flexible spell points system, but casting spells risks furthering their pact with their patron, which eventually turns the warlock into a mindless slave.

    D&D 3rd edition

    The warlock as a standalone character class first appeared in the D&D 3.5 supplement Complete Arcane (2004).[2] This book was written by Richard Baker, who previously wrote Player's Option: Spells & Magic.

    Warlocks in this edition possess numerous innate powers. This includes an at-will ray attack called eldritch blast, which can be used freely, unlike a wizard or sorcerer whose spells can be used only be used a limited number of times per day. They gain powers called invocations as they level up, as well as various defensive abilities, miscellaneous item-related abilities, and improvements to their eldritch blast. They do not gain spells.

    They use the d6 hit dice, similar to the rogue and second-weakest in this edition after the sorcerer/wizard's d4. They have average base attack and good Will saves as a cleric, and light armor proficiency. Charisma powers their class abilities, most of which can be used an unlimited number of times per day, unlike most spellcasters in this edition.

    D&D 4th edition

    The warlock is one of eight character classes appearing in the Player's Handbook (4e) (2008), appearing on pages 129-142.. In this edition of the game, the warlock is an arcane striker, a role dedicated to dealing large amounts of damage to individual foes.

    Warlocks are described as drawing their power from primordial beings and ancient lore, and tieflings are particularly drawn to the class. As presented in the Player's Handbook, the warlock chooses one of three pacts: Fey Pact, who draw their power from animist beings of the feywild; Infernal Pact, whose study lore crafted by devils who once opposed Asmodeus; and Star Pact, who draw maddening power from the Far Realm.

    A warlock's powers are known as spells, and Charisma benefits their ability.

    The warlock's inclusion as a core race is speculated to be influenced by the popularity of World of Warcraft, which included a warlock class.

    D&D 5th edition

    The warlock is one of twelve character classes appearing in the Player's Handbook (5e) (2014), and the only one which did not also appear in the third edition Player's Handbook.

    Warlocks draw their power from a pact with an otherworldly patron, gaining unique abilities depending on patron. The Player's Handbook presents three possible patrons: an Archfey, a powerful faerie creature; the Fiend, an evil extraplanar being such as a demon lord or archdevil; or a Great Old One, a Far Realm creature or elder evil such as Cthulhu or Tharizdun. Xanathar's Guide to Everything (2017), p.54-57 also introduces the Celestial and the Hexblade, the latter being an entity from the Shadowfell.

    Warlocks gain various cantrips, spells, and invocations. They may take eldritch blast as a cantrip which can be cast at will, but unlike in earlier editions this ability is optional. At third level they gain either a familiar, a special pact weapon, or a Book of Shadows which affords the warlock three extra cantrips to use at will.

    Creative origins

    The AD&D 2nd edition sourcebook Player's Option: Spells & Magic (1996), p.83-85 describes the warlock's inspiration in European folklore beliefs of witchcraft, in which women were accused of using magic and consorting with demons or making a pact with the Devil.

    Renaissance-era belief in witchcraft was infleunced by Malleus Maleficarum (published 1487). It was believed that men could also become witches, although less commonly; the word warlock often referred to male witches. Accusations of witchcraft were often used by the nobility for political gain or to discredit powerful women.

    The etymology of warlock is thought to derive from Old English wǣrloga, meaning truce-breaker or, ironically, pact-breaker. In Old Norse myth, breaking one's word is considered highly shameful and unmanly, suggesting that this name was highly insulting. There is some speculation that warlock derives from varðlokkur, Old Norse for spirit-caller, but this etymology is disputed.

    Development

    The Warlock's most radical mechanic is that 90% of his spell effects have no daily limit, a major departure from the traditional Vancian magic system. According to designer Rich Baker:[3]

    "The warlock's biggest advantage is no real limit on the number of times per day he can use his powers. ... The thinking here is that in most D&D games, your characters are probably going to be in only 15 to 20 rounds of combat between rests and spell recoveries. So after your spellcaster has a total daily spell allocation of 20 spells or more (say, around 5th level), his real limit is the number of actions he gets per day -- the number of specific opportunities he has to cast a spell. So the warlock is still bound to the same ultimate limit that any moderate-level wizard deals with."

    References

    Sours: https://dungeonsdragons.fandom.com/wiki/Warlock
    Ranked! Worst to Best Warlock in Dungeons and Dragons 5e

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